$400K Per Year and Done by 2:30 — Inside Milly Tamati’s Generalist World

B (31:29)

And then you had the links in your featured section. So of these 3 surfaces, we've been measuring which one gets the most clicks. Would you like to guess which one gets the most clicks?

A (31:39)

Oh, I love that you're doing this, Jay. I need you to come and interview me more often so you can give me some more data stuff. I would take a guess that it's the one, like my featured posts, If I had to guess, it would be the featured post on my profile that would drive the clicks.

B (31:57)

Your results may be different than mine, but I can tell you from my profile, the number one link is the custom profile link, followed by the button, and a distant, distant third is the featured links.

A (32:10)

Interesting. Interesting. 'Cause I guess with the custom link, people can be just in the feed, right? And see that they don't have to click through to your profile to get there.

B (32:21)

Actually, no, this is the crazy thing. The custom button is what shows up in the feed. So the custom profile link is only viewed on your profile. And that, this is also what's crazy to me. So yeah, we've measured it. I don't have the numbers right in front of me, but my memory says the sample that I had, there was like 60 links on the custom profile link, 40 clicks on the button, and then it was something crazy like 5 or maybe even 3 on the featured post. Wow. Like way, way, way lower. So yeah, we've been playing around with like, the nice thing about the custom profile link is you can add whatever text you want there. You can make whatever call to action. Like you could say, take the generalist quiz.

A (32:58)

Yeah. Oh, I need to go check that out. Yeah.

B (33:2)

Which is my next question, which was when you do have a call to action in a post, is it join the newsletter because we have this jobs board or is it go to the generalist quiz, which I know was like your main front door for a long time?

A (33:13)

It will be whatever is most relevant. So we've got a couple of like, I would say core, like lead magnets that depending on the posts, we would like put that lead magnet in. So for example, one is absolutely the quiz and another one would be more like, so if I'm more talking, say about, um, helping someone get a job, then I'd be like, hey, go to generalist.world, sign up. And on Tuesday, I'm gonna send you 40 curated jobs. So it just depends. And I think like having a variety of those lead magnets that are like tried and tested We probably have about 3 or 4 that I would typically use now and about 40 that I tried and just flopped or like didn't work, didn't convert as strongly as I wanted. So I think that's the whole job as the founder, right? It's like having these ideas, throwing them out to the world and seeing which ones really, really stick and then just doubling down. And I think I'm in this funny stage of business. I don't know when this happened. I don't know if you resonate with this, but the first stage of business is like survival. I was selling my stuff on eBay to like make payroll and to like keep keep this thing alive. And it was so— God, I do not miss those days. I just can feel it in my body being like this, like, survival stage. And then something clicked, something changed. Like, we got past this stage, and now I feel like we're in this stage where it very much feels safe. And I'm saying that as like, I don't know if that's like a— there's a good and a shadow to being in the safe phase, right? So it feels safe, it feels secure, and it feels very much Like, we're just operating. It's like, we know what works, we're just in the operating stage. And I think my challenge in this is like basically reining myself in as someone who is like the generalist, the tinkerer who loves new ideas, keeping myself like, okay, gotta keep the ship sailing, gotta keep us focused.

B (35:2)

I do resonate with this to a degree. I had a conversation with a coach of mine, again, this is like in 2018 or '19, And I had gone from like surviving to now I'm comfortable, but I wanted to like chase these nice new shiny financial goals. I wasn't hitting 6 figures yet. So like in my mind I was like, that's the goal. $100,000 a year should be like the obvious next thing. But I just wasn't actually motivated by a pretty arbitrary number. And what he told me, he said, you will rise to the level of your comfort. So if you are comfortable, you're gonna kind of stay there. Yeah. And so if you want to hit this goal or some other goal, you need to create some positive tension or discomfort to actually get you there. So we've gone through a couple stages now, and I could certainly scale the team back to a place where it's like, we're good, we're operating, this is fine. And we were kind of there, but The things I wanted to do, we just didn't have the capacity. So now we're in this new place where I feel like I'm in like a new season of survival with payroll because it's like we've hired more, we're trying to do more. The business is working, but cash flow becomes more nuanced and challenging to navigate. And I think that's kind of a good thing. Yeah. But I don't know, this is, this is the tension I often feel with this idea you brought up earlier of like a calm nervous system because I could have a calmer nervous system, but I don't know if that would grow this business. Maybe it would, maybe like it would follow through in some ways where the content actually resonates better and I take a less but better approach and that works. The shape of things that I put in place now, it's kind of like the, what is it, a lobster they talk about where like The lobster will get to a point where it has to shed its own skin to become a bigger version of itself. It like has to feel uncomfortable in that shell for a second. So it's challenging because like there's wisdom in both of these approaches.

A (37:11)

Yeah, I think a lot about this idea of like, what's the right size of business? You know, so for example, I was on a podcast a couple of weeks ago, and the interviewer asked me, you know, what's your dream for Generalist World? And I could tell that the angle that they were hoping I would say is like, we're going to double revenue and add a zero, and we're gonna like triple our email list. And I kind of sat back and considered it, really considered it. And I was like, do you know what? I think I'm in it. I think I'm in the dream. I think this is it. And it really helped me see and helped me kind of reflect on like, what is the quote unquote right size of a business? And there's no doubt that I could like, Grow the team, add more products, push. But I think like when we are like the solo founder of something, business growth is just one possibility of growth in our life. And I feel like I'm going through, in my like personal life, I'm going through a big growth transformation. Like the lobster is being shed. Yeah. A big growth transformation. And so I think this is a privilege that we get to do. Uh, that when we are the founder, we have that ability and like agency to put the brakes on a little bit and just to be like, right, we're just gonna coast. The business is gonna coast for a little bit. Everyone's getting paid great. We are still like growing steadily, but it's not like hypergrowth. And in the meantime, I'm gonna go and work on myself. And it's cyclical. So that once I come out of this, maybe then I'll be feeling in a place where we're like, right, like, let's level up. But for now, I'm so happy with where things are. And I feel like that's not spoken about enough. It's like, it feels like taboo to be like, I'm stoked. I'm stoked. This business is a great size. We make about $400,000 a year. I get to finish work every day at 2. I love the people I work with. My community members are some of my best friends and they're like starting businesses together and I'm like, great, it's enough.

B (39:19)

This leads me into an area I wanted to explore, which is the model of your membership is a lifetime purchase. And when I heard you talk on Chanel's podcast, it sounded like that was a decision that you made at some point and then said, I'm going to then augment our revenue with sponsorship and partnerships. Both of these models, well, I suppose on the partnership side, ideally there is a long-term relationship that renews with that partner many, many times. But a lot of times for folks listening to this, like they have a lot of sponsors that don't renew either because the sponsor chooses not to, because it wasn't performative, or maybe they didn't enjoy doing that. Talk to me now, a year or two removed from the decision to go away from recurring memberships, about the implications of that decision, good or bad.

A (40:5)

To date, it's my favorite decision I've ever made in the business and one of the most controversial. Like I remember at the time, Everyone, all of my founder friends were like, you're mad. What are you doing? You don't delete your recurring revenue. It's like the only rule of business, Milly, come on. But it was a gut feeling and based on some data as well that the community on the surface, it's a professional community, but inside it's so much more. It is, people have described it as a lifeline for them. And so I'm like, okay, it feels a bit shite, you know, if someone you know, maybe they lose their job and then their membership renews and then they can't afford it. Or, you know, what I was observing in the community is, and what people were feeding back is they were like, well, you know, we don't know if we want to like massively invest in these other people because, you know, their membership's up in May. And so maybe we won't see them again. And I was like, that's so fair. And I had built Generalist World from this island, right, of 191 people. So I was literally living in a very, very small, tight-knit community. And so many of the principles that I was observing of being this community member in a very small, rural, west coast of Scotland community, I was applying to Generalist World. And I was like, okay, so one of the principles is that everyone is aligned long-term. That's why everyone's volunteering on this island. Like, we were all on 2 or 3 different boards. Like, it was a really volunteering, giving back culture. And that's what I wanted to create in GW. So all of this to say, one day I deleted all of our recurring revenue and I made everyone a lifetime member. And then I kind of, well, there was nerves doing it, but ultimately my brain, my body, everything was like, look, it's gonna be fine. A big part of that confidence came from, we had just passed at the time, I think it was 20,000 email subscribers. It was around that level. Wow. And so we were starting to get sponsorships and those sponsorships, I went the opposite way. So I didn't wanna work with lots of sponsors on like one-off deals. I wanted to have long-term recurring multi-channel partnerships, and that's what we have always done. And so I work with a couple of brands each year. I've actually, I'm just about to announce it today, have just signed on with beehiiv as their creator in residence. And so that's a year-long partnership, which essentially is just like sets GW up, right? And so the recurring revenue, I would much rather get that from like companies and then be able to have some flexibility when it comes to like the B2C side, as a lot of people are paying for their own membership.

B (42:51)

One concern I've had about lifetime memberships when I've like considered the model in the past is Yes, you have this long-term alignment, but also I've just seen time and time again that a lot of people pay attention to what they pay for. So I would love to hear like a counterpoint or some level of like in between if you've seen it. If you have somebody who joined as a lifetime member like a couple years ago, maybe it's not even somebody, how would you describe the continued engagement into year 2 or 3 if you have it for somebody who made this investment?

A (43:29)

One of the first documents I ever wrote for GW, before I came up with the regulated nervous system KPI, was the Calm Community Doc. And this Calm Community Doc, it lays out, and I've barely changed it since writing it, and it lays out that life happens. You will ebb and flow through the community, whether you're here annually or eventually whether you're here for a lifetime. And that is the take that I have adopted for all of our members. So I am very explicit in like engagement for me is not the goal. If you need to disappear and go on paternity leave, or if you're going through a really hectic period of your life, there is no expectation to show up. GW is a resource to be there and to support you if and when you need us. And in terms of like over the long term, I think giving people that flexibility to be like adults and be like, when you need us, you can come in. Uh, has only kind of like deepened that relationship and that value.

B (44:29)

I'm curious about this creator-in-residence opportunity and your take on sponsorships generally. What have you found to be your favorite and best reciprocal relationship in terms of how you're showing up for these partners?

A (44:45)

Yeah, that's very easy. My favorite is beehiiv. They are the best that I've worked with for a couple of reasons. The first is that beehiiv and GW started not at a dissimilar time. So they were like the first subscription I ever paid for when I didn't really have, you know, $1,000 to pay for it. But I was like, I recognized that I needed a way to email people. And I remember reading Tyler's kind of founding story and how he'd built Morning Brew. And I was like, okay, I could go with someone, another provider who's a bit more established, but I am willing to take a bet. on this guy and this product. So in some ways I feel like our businesses have grown up together. And then I think when it comes to the actual relationship, I was just organically posting about them because again, my dear diary approach, like I'm sending a lot of emails, that's how I'm also selling. So they were organically coming up in a lot of my content. And so then that led me to just becoming pals, like friends with a couple of folks on the team, which then led to like kind of smaller creator work. Yeah. Which then led to, you know, I was on my way actually to Columbus, Ohio for a keynote earlier this year. Yeah. Hello. It was awesome. Yeah, I saw on your LinkedIn, I was like, oh my God, I didn't know Jay was in Columbus. So I was there in April doing a keynote. And I was on this plane. And as I was on the plane, one of their team, Tony, like texted me and was like, hey, you're coming to America, right? Like, we're doing this like big filming day. for this huge launch we're doing. Do you want to be the face of it? And I was like, heck yeah, that sounds so fun. So around New York, I had like a full film crew the whole day. And it was like, again, telling the story of Generalist World. And so there's been such a reciprocal benefit because as they've grown and as they have amplified me and my story, Generalist World has had loads of eyeballs go on it as well. And so The more successful I am and the newsletter is, the more people that find beehiiv. And I think it's so relevant for generalists because whether it's a newsletter or a podcast or a community or a digital product, it's kind of like the generalist tool. Choose whichever thing you want to do. The last thing I'll say is beehiiv is different from like the creator perspective because they give me so much freedom. So like sometimes when you work with brands, they're like, we trust our creators to like create, but then they're like, oh, we got to change that and we got to change that and can you write it this way? Where beehiiv is like, girl, you know your people, we are just here to support you. And so it's been honestly like a joy to work with them. Yeah,

B (47:28)

that's what I was kind of alluding to is partnerships often take very different forms company to company. So I was curious with having put so much emphasis on that now in your business, if there's kind of a go-to shape that you have found for these partnerships that fits you best and has led to renewed contracts or long-term success with these partners.

A (47:53)

Now that I have kind of landed on this shape with beehiiv, I would love to replicate that with a few other partners where sometimes a partner will come in and they're mostly interested in the newsletter or like, for example, we just ran International Generalist Day, we partnered with Netlify. And so they were very interested in being in front of these IRL events. And now we're talking about a bigger, longer, deeper partnership. So I think it just really depends on the brand, but then it's up to us as founders to have these different assets and to be able to kind of pitch it and mold it to be like, hey, so you're really interested. You know, Netlify was such a no-brainer because as part of International Generalist Day, we were running our first hackathon. And so it's like, sweet, let's give everyone credits and you can build live. So, and again, that relationship came about on X where I was like, I was actually just looking for a food sponsor. And then I ended up speaking with KP and we were like, actually, this could be really cool. Like, what if we did something bigger together? And that came over the course of like just 2 Zoom calls. The first one, we just talked about community building for so long, we forgot to talk anything about the deal or anything about a partnership. We had to do another call to be like, oh yeah, we should like probably talk about what we were going to talk about. And I think maybe this is one of my underlying repeating things that keep coming back. It's like, it is truly all about relationships. It is the deeper you can create these relationships, the more integrity you can have in these relationships to be someone who does what they say that they said they would do. And who I think is like also selective in who they work with. So I say no to most brands if I haven't heard of them or if I don't know them, if I'm not using them, it won't make sense for me to like represent them. It all comes back to this like reputation idea, right? So I'm, everything I'm doing out there, everything I'm putting online, it's like tiny bricks of this wall of the reputation of Milly. And yeah, it's my job to make sure that I'm like really looking after that.

B (49:59)

Last question then, Milly. Thank you for your time. Is there anything that you have strong conviction and believe as it relates to being a content creator that you wanna pass on to our audience?

A (50:11)

Be more weird. Be way more weird. I don't care what platform it's on. I think that lo-fi is in. I have this theory. It's funny to have this theory and say it on a podcast, but that podcast listening for me has gone down. Like I used to listen to, you know, maybe like 4 or 5 hours of podcasts a week. And now I'm lucky if I get in half an hour, like my podcast listening has gone down. And I think when I look at why that is, it feels like so many podcasts now are scripted or like so much of their like topics, it feels like they're like surface level, kind of like AI-y. And the same for social media. So this is a sandbox we're all playing in where everyone is using AI. AI is not a bad thing in and of itself, but if you are not using it to give yourself space to become more weird and stand out, then you're really missing a trick. So I'd say, yeah, be more honest and lean more into what makes you, you.

B (51:12)

If you enjoyed this episode, please consider leaving a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify and letting me know. We had a batch of new reviews on Apple Podcasts last week. Yes, it got us back up the charts. We are now being recommended next to some of the biggest shows on the planet. So please take a second, review us on Apple Podcasts, help us keep the momentum. Those reviews go a long way in helping us grow the show. If you want to learn more about Milly, visit her website at generalist.world. There's a link to that and her LinkedIn plus X account in the show notes. Thank you for listening. I'll talk to you next week. Bye.